As any self-conscious teenager will tell you, we mostly just want to fit in. So we conform to the behaviors of a selected group, with acceptance in the group a sufficient justification for acting in a particular manner. In sum, peer pressure does not die out after high school, it merely manifests in adults seeking social approval via cohort-specific status indicators. As I'm sure most people are thinking, SWPLs are the most obvious example of this phenomena. They make a show of certain behaviors, such as studying abroad, wearing ironic t-shirts, or eating sushi, in order to message to other members of their group. No matter that getting a moustache tattooed on one's finger is absolutely retarded, that sushi tastes like crap, or that marathons actually kill people - none of that matters because social status, a primary means of propagating one's genes, supersedes reason.
We do stuff so that other people will like us and we have certain opinions so that other people will like us. If you read this blog, you probably understand that I really don't care about ingratiating myself to others. I care about what maybe 20 people think of me and everyone else is largely meaningless. I don't seek animus from others, but neither do I define my happiness on external opinion. Fittingly, the commensurate social memes associated with various behaviors or beliefs largely do not matter to me. In a post entitled I Don't Care about Class and Politics, I wrote:
...the "anonymous" commenter then implies that a divide in culture must create a divide in politics. As if, hand holding must extend from the boardroom, to the voting booths, to the bar. The left's amusing coalition of disparate group undermines this supposition, with upper class, secular, class elitist Jews voting for the same inane policies as the church-going, uneducated, ghetto blacks...If two groups share a common political vision despite holding different positions within that future nation, then so be it.Sometimes though, I can't help it. I reject something not because I disagree on principle, but because I can't stand the individuals who practice or believe something. In this vein, Mangan posts on his reticence in "buying local":
But, as stated above, I can easily separate the man from his political opinions. If an uneducated hillbilly wants to vote for the same thing I do, then who cares about his snaggle tooth or the fact that we couldn't converse for more than 3 minutes? Just don't bother me for cigarettes at 3 in the morning or try to hit on my daughter.
most of the people doing the encouraging as well as many if not most of the businesses involved are the usual gang of hipsters, SWPLs, left-liberals, environmentalist goofballs, AGW promoters, anti-racists, and people who want to control every aspect of everyone's life in the name of "sustainability" or whatever other faddish nonsense is the latest to come down the pike. In short, I can't see any good reason for allying myself with these people. Most of them will be against everything I believe in, and the few that aren't are too cowered to do anything but go along.Not exactly the same thing, but note that Mangan considers the sum of a phenomenon in rejecting something with which he sympathizes.
(OK that was an extremely long introduction to get to the intended point.) Basically, this is how I feel about potheads and other drug users. I don't see anything particularly wrong with drug use, even the heavy stuff like meth or heroin. There's nothing intrinsically immoral about doing drugs, especially if one can do so sporadically and maintain a productive way of life, as in cokehead corporate types. In principle, I support drug use because I think people should have the freedom to do whatever they want. Does drug use lead to degeneracy? Sure, but that's oblique to the discussion.
Yet I absolutely hate the wider drug culture and it colors my support of drugs independent of its actual use in a real-world context. I can't stand the kinds of people who actually do drugs, even though I don't think they're doing anything wrong. I hate the listlessness, the pseudo-enlightenment, the niche culture, and the general anti-establishment, soft-anarchy mindset of drug users. I hate how they speak, dress, and act. I hate their sanctimony and their attitude. I hate their passion for something of no value. I hate the general behavior and personality traits of drug users.
So while I sympathize with their position, albeit one motivated by self-interest and not justice, I still celebrate their political and social failings.
40 comments:
The pot-head culture in general is particularly annoying, so annoying that some of the smarter pot-heads hate it. (A few I knew hated it so much that they stopped being pot-heads.)
Have you seen the piece about potheads on Michael Corens Arena? I thought exactly the same thing...
a. Drug use doesn't lead to degeneracy. Liberal shit culture that says degeneracy isn't degeneracy at all but an equally valid lifestyle choice leads to degeneracy. All drugs were legally available on any street corner in pre-shit america. Fun aside: the US and Japan at that time were the world leading producers of Cocaine. Link: http://images5.cpcache.com/product_zoom/484521775v0_480x480_Front_Color-Black_padToSquare-true.jpg
b. Druggies act like druggies for the same reason neo-nazis are obsessed with the nazis. Modern life under the dominant liberal shit culture is horrible and they want an escape
c. The quasi-legal status of marijuana is a deliberate move to make sure that only liberals get into the business. Otherwise, conservatives who don't smoke weed would enter the market and rapidly dominate it.
d. I do drugs regularly, all kinds, and I think you'd like me. Tobacco and Alcohol have a long history in the west, there's no reason smoking weed is an anathema to western civilization.
"Does drug use lead to degeneracy? Sure, but that's oblique to the discussion."
Say wut? Why should I not care about a behavioral pattern that 'leads to degeneracy' if I don´t particularly want to live in a degenerate society?
Druggies act like druggies for the same reason neo-nazis are obsessed with the nazis.
The quasi-legal status of marijuana is a deliberate move to make sure that only liberals get into the business. Otherwise, conservatives who don't smoke weed would enter the market and rapidly dominate it.
Exhibit A for the damaging effects of drug use.
OneSDTV: Your position makes me want to ask how you feel about prescription drug use. I am in the Pharmacy profession and I see an amazing amount of Antidepressant use. Supposedly, about 10% of Americans are on Antidepressants, with twice as many women as men taking this “escapist” medication. I work around nurses and I would say anecdotally that at least half of the female nurses I work with routinely take Antidepressants or Antianxiolytics. I personally have never taken an Antidepressant, so I cannot attest to what they feel or don’t feel when they are on these meds. If I feel like the world is getting to be too much, I go to sleep, wake-up, and the problem is solved. But, I find it interesting how dependent females are on some kind of tablet or capsule to make their world bearable. And not just Antidepressants or Mother’s Little Helper. I find it interesting that the, majority women in the health related fields are so incapable of dealing with life without some kind of pharmaceutical help. I personally think that constantly dealing with death and disease is injurious to the female psyche, being so inherently designed to produce and nurture life. But, I think their needs are no different than what you point out in the “drug culture”.
I actually respect illegal drug users more because they aren’t hiding behind a Physician/God to make life more bearable for themselves. I also find adults that take some kind of lipid lowering medication to be just as pathetic. It is like they belong to some kind of club that revolves around their Cholesterol and HDL/LDL levels (the equivalent of a pissing contest: “Oh your HDL is 39? I’m a 45!”). Anyway, just curious as to your opinion.
Similar to your ephemeral wigger phase, drug use for most people I know, myself included, is/was a temporary indulgence and delimited to conducive social environments, say, latter high school and undergraduate years.
Once you graduate, smoking weed looks pretty fucking immature.
Also, have you ever done shrooms, acid, mescaline?
I haven't in a few years but the experiences I did have early on in college stuck with me in a way few others in my life have. To clarify, I had several bad trips where the experience itself was highly unpleasant. That said, among other things, the visceral self-awareness imposed by psychedelics caused me to reassess and ultimately significantly alter my behavior and direction in life. I'm not exactly sure how to qualify the experience, but it surely was not "pseudo-enlightenment".
From what I know about the studies LSD in the '60s etc., my personal "maturation through tripping" reflects the positive outcomes research psychiatrists observed when experimenting with it for therapeutic applications.
Surely psychedelics are not for everyone, but if you're emotionally grounded and intellectually strong enough to handle it (this is probably a minority of the population), you probably should at least try it. I'm talking to you, One.
Also, have you ever done shrooms, acid, mescaline?
I haven't in a few years but the experiences I did have early on in college stuck with me in a way few others in my life have. To clarify, I had several bad trips where the experience itself was highly unpleasant. That said, among other things, the visceral self-awareness imposed by psychedelics caused me to reassess and ultimately significantly alter my behavior and direction in life. I'm not exactly sure how to qualify the experience, but it surely was not "pseudo-enlightenment".
From what I know about the studies LSD in the '60s etc., my personal "maturation through tripping" reflects the positive outcomes research psychiatrists observed when experimenting with it for therapeutic applications.
Surely psychedelics are not for everyone, but if you're emotionally grounded and intellectually strong enough to handle it (this is probably a minority of the population), you probably should at least try it. I'm talking to you, One.
I also find adults that take some kind of lipid lowering medication to be just as pathetic. It is like they belong to some kind of club that revolves around their Cholesterol and HDL/LDL levels (the equivalent of a pissing contest: “Oh your HDL is 39? I’m a 45!”).
LOL. People will one-up about anything, won't they? If not their dick-size or their bench-press 1RM or their marathon time, then this shit. By the way, I'm at 8% bodyfat--how about you?
drug use for most people I know, myself included, is/was a temporary indulgence and delimited to conducive social environments, say, latter high school and undergraduate years.
And yet that might be the worst time to smoke a lot of pot or drink a lot of booze, since the brain is still developing up until about age 25.
But, I find it interesting how dependent females are on some kind of tablet or capsule to make their world bearable. And not just Antidepressants or Mother’s Little Helper.
Hot button alert! Anyone not in a mood to read a venting post needs to scroll down now...
My ex-She Whose Name Will Not Be Spoken-was/is one of these women. It was,in fact,one of the major reasons that I finally just up and quit trying one day. I couldn't,as it turns out,compete with a pill,much less an entire cabinet full of pills to use in her Dial-A-Mood
quest.
And I was one of the lucky ones-I got off relatively lightly,since we were never legally married and we never shared a domicile.
I'm sure that the Divorce Industry types would be horrified if prescription anti-depressants were outlawed tomorrow. Their bank accounts would certainly take a major hit.
My particular gripe was Xanax. In her,at least,it seemed to produce very genuine short term memory loss. She'd do something crazy,take a Xanax to make herself feel better about doing whatever crazy thing it was that she'd done,and magically forget about ever having done it.
It wasn't until the 5th or 6th time that I was asking her about the crazy stunt du jour and getting these blank stares that I realized,"My God,she really doesn't remember doing whatever crazy stunt she pulled. (The crazy stunts invariably involved spending unavailable money. Usually on seriously overpriced shoes or other fashion accessories.)
I finally decided that you could have hooked her up to a polygraph and questioned her about the 300 dollar shoes that had mysteriously appeared. She would have passed with flying colors when she hypothetically told the hypothetical analyst that she had no idea how the things had found their way into the closet.
Cautionary note-for those getting into a "relationship",snooping is acceptable if it involves the medicine cabinet. Get a look at what kind of pills she takes,and if there's anything besides birth control pills and a bottle of aspirin behind the mirror,run like hell.
I can't stand people who wear thumb and index finger rings. I'd sooner associate with Jerry Sandusky.
Men with ponytails. How many of them AREN'T douchebags? I think I knew one who wasn't.
Congrats on your publication by AltRight. Was that a one off or will you have a regular slot?
Congrats on your publication by AltRight. Was that a one off or will you have a regular slot?
No, I think Richard Spencer just decided to publish the article. He did it once before too:
http://www.alternativeright.com/main/blogs/hbd-human-biodiversity/violence-and-group-pathology/
I absolutely hate the wider drug culture and it colors my support of drugs independent of its actual use in a real-world context. I can't stand the kinds of people who actually do drugs, even though I don't think they're doing anything wrong. I hate the listlessness, the pseudo-enlightenment, the niche culture, and the general anti-establishment, soft-anarchy mindset of drug users. I hate how they speak, dress, and act. I hate their sanctimony and their attitude. I hate their passion for something of no value. I hate the general behavior and personality traits of drug users.
You sounded a little preachy here, so I decided to apply your words to a drug culture of which I'm a peripheral part: beer-drinking NASCAR fans.
Listlessness? Among the abusers, absolutely.
Pseudo-enlightenment? You could start a Sirius radio channel making fun of the beer-inspired enlightenment of NASCAR fans. (Whoops, too late: Blue Collar Comedy is already a Sirius radio channel.)
Niche culture? Absolutely.
Anti-establishment soft-anarchy mindset? You'll find a whole lot more secessionists at Talladega than you will in Greenwich Village.
I hate how they speak, dress, and act? These people not only root for drivers identified by big numbers surrounded by advertising, they gather in beer-drinking bands nationwide on Sundays wearing clothing with big numbers and advertising to collectively use beer as their support of various numbers circling counterclockwise on televised race tracks reaches a frenzied crescendo.
I hate their sanctimony and their attitude. Try entering a Southern sports bar on NASCAR Sunday and explaining why NASCAR really isn't important.
I hate their passion for something of no value. See previous comment.
I hate the general personality and behavior traits of drug users. Wow...as I mentioned, I'm a peripheral part of this culture, one degree of separation from some big fans. But when I take the words that I think were meant for druggies graduating from marijuana into really mind-altering stuff and apply them to my friends, they still ring true. A different analysis could be made for Xanax-using SWPLs, and it would fit just as well.
Good words, OneSTDV. I see your point.
One, you are like a half step from moral maturity. As soon as you realize that if wouldn't want your sister or daughter doing it, you shouldn't support it among strangers either, you will have arrived.
To clarify, I had several bad trips where the experience itself was highly unpleasant. That said, among other things, the visceral self-awareness imposed by psychedelics caused me to reassess and ultimately significantly alter my behavior and direction in life. I'm not exactly sure how to qualify the experience, but it surely was not "pseudo-enlightenment".
From what I know about the studies LSD in the '60s etc., my personal "maturation through tripping" reflects the positive outcomes research psychiatrists observed when experimenting with it for therapeutic applications.
I couldn't have said it better myself.
Regarding sushi, de gustibus non disputandum est. Sushi tastes great to me. It's not a pose.
...if wouldn't want your sister or daughter doing it, you shouldn't support it among strangers either
There's a difference between supporting it and not persecuting it. The War on Drugs has been a disaster.
There's a difference between supporting it and not persecuting it. The War on Drugs has been a disaster.
How about a policy of ostracization? No wars, no arrests. But anybody known to do drugs shall be disqualified from holding any important position.
It'll have the same effect on your life as having a huge tattoo on your face, or something like that.
How about a policy of ostracization? No wars, no arrests. But anybody known to do drugs shall be disqualified from holding any important position.
It'll have the same effect on your life as having a huge tattoo on your face, or something like that.
That would be a far saner and more sensible approach than SWAT teams kicking in your door, shooting your dog, and torching your young daughter with flash grenades.
There's nothing intrinsically immoral about doing drugs, especially if one can do so sporadically and maintain a productive way of life, as in cokehead corporate types.
Wouldn't Kant disagree with you? (categorical imperative?) Given how not everyone can be a functional drug user, I mean.
In principle, I support drug use because I think people should have the freedom to do whatever they want. Does drug use lead to degeneracy? Sure, but that's oblique to the discussion.
Drug use doesn't exist in isolation. It requires a market.
OneSDTV: Your position makes me want to ask how you feel about prescription drug use. I am in the Pharmacy profession and I see an amazing amount of Antidepressant use.
Apparently I'm the last man in America who doesn't abuse prescription drugs recreationally. From where I'm sitting it looks like the whole world is hooked on prescription meds.
As my father (a WWII veteran) would say, "I wouldn't want that person with me in a fox hole." People who chronically rely on drugs or alcohol or any altered mental states, in the end aren't worth shit.
There may be a time in the future where we will have to separate the wheat from the chaff. In the meantime, give me a thousand healthy, clean, rational men, who's only irrationality is their sense of alturism and devotion to a cause, and I will take over the world.
The crazy stunts invariably involved spending unavailable money. Usually on seriously overpriced shoes or other fashion accessories.
Now we're getting to the real woman problem. Jesus H Christ, women and their money-money-money so I can buy crap-crap-crap! They ever heard the word "save"?
not the main point of your post, but do we really have to be reverse-Stalinists and make everything political? i've had fun going abroad (don't think it made me "enlightened" or anything) and i genuinely like sushi. i like fast food too (faux-blue collar conservative cred?) and've never even thought of eating food to show how cultured i am, that'd be more like someone who goes out a bunch for tapas or some shit, lol. if this automatically dooms me to SWPLdom that's kinda goofy.
OneSTDV is making the same mistake that Ayn Rand made: taking his own personal taste and calling it a law of nature.
There is nothing so delicious to me as a good dragon roll with smoked eel. Some hate it. I don't mind broccoli and brussels sprouts, but people with the "super taster" gene find them intolerably bitter.
HBD says that we're going to find different things either tasty and healthful, or the opposite. For OneSTDV to launch into a tirade about taste without regard to HBD is ironic in the extreme.
studying abroad: Is a ton of fun
eating sushi: sushi tastes good and is healthy for you.
marathons: are good cardio. I'm not as into cardio but I understand why someone would want to run one.
do we really have to be reverse-Stalinists and make everything political?
I don't and in the linked post I explicitly state that I couldn't care less about the political/social implications of various things. Specifically, almost all my opinions on foods or NASCAR are based on the actual value of the actual thing, not the social ideas linked to the thing. But in the case of drug use, I just can't be that discerning.
And the larger problem is that most people can rarely ever separate the social from the objective value.
studying abroad: Is a ton of fun
eating sushi: sushi tastes good and is healthy for you.
marathons: are good cardio. I'm not as into cardio but I understand why someone would want to run one.
Also a response to "Mr. Rational": I don't necessarily decry studying abroad or eating foreign foods. (Cardio on the other hand - horrible for you.) I'm instead criticizing the people (SWPLs) who do these things merely because they believe it enriches them socially, it provides them with unique, enlightening experience, it makes them look cultured amongst their peer group.
Even back when I used drugs it was something I was ashamed of and tried to hide from other people. I wasn't using hardcore drugs either. I didn't like druggies back then and I don't like them now. I automatically reevaluate my opinion of somebody after I find out that they use drugs.
OneSTDV,
How do you separate what someone actually wants from what a subgroup they associate with likes? Don't people like hanging out with people that enjoy the same things as them?
P.S. Cardio is good for a lot of different sports, and its certainly good for people with weight issues. There is a reason people have done different kinds of cardio for thousands of years. Even the term "marathon" comes from a greek military messenger that had to run really fast to spread military intelligence:
http://www.lakepowell.net/marathon.html
i get that it can be difficult to disentangle personal tastes/views/whatever from social settings, no matter how independently people insist they developed them. maybe growing up in California is part of why i like sushi but my main thing is that i don't ever remember not liking it and feeling like i should try to develop a taste for it. i can think of other things i didn't like as a kid that grew on me -- alcohol ('course,) certain music -- but while with certain things i'd agree that people can definitely try too hard and "trick" themselves into liking it (this is way more true of music than food/drink) in some cases it's good to stay humble and not always follow your gut natural instinct.
basically i'm stating my position that Official Conservative Values should be sushi-inclusive, is all.
Cardio is good for a lot of different sports... Even the term "marathon" comes from a greek military messenger that had to run really fast to spread military intelligence
Uh, that cardio killed Pheidippides. Bad example, dude. You just proved One's point.
"even the heavy stuff like meth or heroin"
Those two drugs are so addictive, that I think its truly good they are illegal. They must do more than simply stimulate the mesolimbic reward pathway. Some people who are desperate to quit them literally just cant without help.
Those two drugs [heroin and meth] are so addictive, that I think its truly good they are illegal
At least heroin doesn't cause people to go psycho. Junkies just slouch around in a groggy state. The main danger of heroin is to the addict himself, from overdosing or contracting AIDS by sharing needles.
But a meth-head is an entirely different creature. I'd be reluctant to legalize meth.
Some thoughts on drugs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHzdsFiBbFc
I don't necessarily decry studying abroad or eating foreign foods. (Cardio on the other hand - horrible for you.) I'm instead criticizing the people (SWPLs) who do these things merely because they believe it enriches them socially, it provides them with unique, enlightening experience, it makes them look cultured amongst their peer group.
Isn't judging a thing by the people who like it, or their alleged reasons for liking it, a fallacy? Even more ironically, it's the same reason DWLs judge anything hinting of HBD: they associate it with Nazi Germany.
Americans treat too many things as shibboleths; if "they" like it, "we" must hate it... and often, vice versa. That's very self-destructive, especially when
(a) there are real reasons for having the same preference/position, and
(b) not being reflexively contrary allows you to appeal to people who might otherwise lean toward the opposition.
After all, why should you allow a camp you hate to dictate any of your positions to you?
... even the heavy stuff like meth or heroin. There's nothing intrinsically immoral about doing drugs, especially if one can do so sporadically and maintain a productive way of life, as in cokehead corporate types.
Simultaneously using meth and maintaining a productive way of life is impossible. Is there an example, anywhere, ever, of someone managing it? Either a person kicks the habit (almost always with outside help, often involuntarily accepted) or ends up dead. "Recreational" meth use does not exist.
The main danger of heroin is to the addict himself, from overdosing or contracting AIDS by sharing needles.
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