But we're not going to be able to do it if we are distracted. We're not going to be able to do it if we spend time vilifying each other. We're not going to be able to do it if we just make stuff up and pretend that facts are not facts.The actual birth certificate has nothing controversial on it, so it leaves basically everyone puzzled as to why he waited so long in releasing it. I'm now satisfied that Obama was born in Hawaii, though the circumstances of his parents' marriage and his early childhood remain mysterious.
We're not going to be able to solve our problems if we get distracted by sideshows and carnival barkers.
We do not have time for this kind of silliness.
What we do know from this event - the Obama administration and the vicious left has no qualms about promoting complete lies. Here's Robert Gibbs two years ago when asked about the birth certificate:
Gibbs: "Are you looking for the President's birth certificate?"So we now know, via the release of his actual birth certificate yesterday, that the one released in 2008 was NOT his actual birth certificate. Thus, this administration has promoted an outright lie. In the end, the conservative point about his "certificate of life birth" was the correct one, a fact implicitly substantiated by the administration itself.
Kinsolving: "Yes."
Gibbs: "It's on the Internet, Lester."
Kinsolving: "No, no, no -- the long form listing his hospital and physician." (Laughter.)
Gibbs: "Lester, this question in many ways continues to astound me. The state of Hawaii provided a copy with the seal of the President's birth. I know there are apparently at least 400,000 people – (laughter) – that continue to doubt the existence of and the certification by the state of Hawaii of the president's birth there, but it's on the Internet because we put it on the Internet for each of those 400,000 to download. I certainly hope by the fourth year of our administration that we'll have dealt with this burgeoning birth controversy."
All the vilification from the left has proved completely unjustified, at least concerning the mainstream consternation of "why won't he just release the damn thing already?" It's funny that an administration that touted itself as championing an age of government transparency took three years to make one phone call. And then instead of admitting the falsehood they promoted to the American public for all this time, Obama denigrates those that brought up this obvious lie.
Of course, the left will continue to attack the strawman crazy birthers, instead of noting that most everyone, like Trump, simply couldn't understand Obama's stubbornness.
36 comments:
I for one, while interested in the location, have been far more interested in the details surrounding his adoption by his mother's second husband and the interesting trip he made in 1979, as Pakistan was closed to US citizens.
Of course, he could have traveled on an Indonesian passport, but that raises the eligibility question again.
The is much to much that is hidden about this man, and his stubborn refusal to clear the air is unsettling.
Bravo on the observation.
"the circumstances of his parents' marriage and his early childhood remain mysterious."
Mysterious? Probably more like sordid. Honestly, I don't want to know.
Stanley Ann Dunham was a real piece of work. So was BHO Sr. At least he has the excuse that he was born in a hut in freakin' Kenya. What was her excuse?
Bunch of weirdos in that family. Which makes me ask, just how far from the tree can the fruit fall?
Momma got knocked up at 17 by a grad student, per the birth cert. Nice.
"So we now know, via the release of his actual birth certificate yesterday, that the one released in 2008 was NOT his actual birth certificate."
No, you lunatic, it was the official form that certifies that a birth certificate exists on file. Which birthers decided to pretend to believe was a forgery, because they are assholes who live in a fantasy world. Now that the actual certificate has been revealed, those accusations have been proven false.
Generally, when you unreasonable accuse someone of lying, and are proven to be wrong, you apologize.
But of course, birthers are assholes, and assholes don't apologize when they're wrong.
Still wating on that apology by Obama for bombing Libya, raising gas prices, stealing an auto company and ignoring the courts and laws in taking over the health care industry. Stealing a trillion from the treasury every year should probably qualify for some kind of mention too.
Dave Hunter said:
"No, you lunatic, it was the official form that certifies that a birth certificate exists on file. Which birthers decided to pretend to believe was a forgery, because they are assholes who live in a fantasy world. Now that the actual certificate has been revealed, those accusations have been proven false.
Generally, when you unreasonable accuse someone of lying, and are proven to be wrong, you apologize.
But of course, birthers are assholes, and assholes don't apologize when they're wrong."
__________________________________
Speaking of assholes... Assholes are those who go on blogs calling people lunatics and assholes rather than just presenting their rebuttal in an non-asshole-y way.
"Assholes are those who go on blogs calling people lunatics and assholes rather than just presenting their rebuttal in an non-asshole-y way."
Blah, blah, hypocrite, blah. Thanks, hall monitor.
@ Dave Hunter:
Someone seems a little peeved.
No, you lunatic, it was the official form that certifies that a birth certificate exists on file. Which birthers decided to pretend to believe was a forgery, because they are assholes who live in a fantasy world. Now that the actual certificate has been revealed, those accusations have been proven false.
Even though, in this very post, I predict that liberals and the MSM will attack a strawman, you do it anyway.
Most mainstream birthers, like Trump, didn't put forth these forgery accusations. Quite simply, they just wanted the LONG-FORM birth certificate to be released. We were confused as to why he refused to release it.
The liberal response, as Gibbs said: "we already released the birth certificate. You can download it and that's the proof, right there. There's nothing else to see."
Well we now know that was a complete lie, as the release of this long-form birth certificate proves. In fact, the question raised (that I quoted) was specifically about the long-form ceritificate - and of course, all the White House journalists laughed at the guy who asked it.
But in the end, he was right.
Nothing about a forgery or a conspriacy. Merely conservatives noted that what was previously provided was not the entire story, per se. And even while liberals denied this and called these conservatives paranoid and crazy, they were right.
"sideshows and carnival barkers"
IOW, let's be clear, white trash.
Dave Hunter said...
"Assholes are those who go on blogs calling people lunatics and assholes rather than just presenting their rebuttal in an non-asshole-y way."
Blah, blah, hypocrite, blah. Thanks, hall monitor.
______________________________
I wasn't taking the trite hypocrite angle, just the asshole angle.
I have no intention, desire, or right to be a "hall monitor" on someone else's blog. I just figured you shouldn't be the only one having all the fun throwing asshole accusations around.
If you are so vehemently against birthers, thinking they are lunatics and assholes, and you are an Obama/Democrat/liberal/Progressive supporter, you should actually welcome them. After all, they just make themselves and Republicans/conservatives look bad, right?
"I just figured you shouldn't be the only one having all the fun throwing asshole accusations around. "
Agreed!
"If you are so vehemently against birthers, thinking they are lunatics and assholes, and you are an Obama/Democrat/liberal/Progressive supporter, you should actually welcome them. After all, they just make themselves and Republicans/conservatives look bad, right?"
I am against stupid. (Especially from OneSTDV, for whom I have developed an unlikely fondness.) Birtherism is stupid. And what difference does it make if it makes Donald Trump and Sarah Palin look bad? (I agree that it really does.) If the media takes them seriously -- and they do -- then this stupid gets spread around until people start to think it's normal.
I am against stupid. (Especially from OneSTDV, for whom I have developed an unlikely fondness.)
Not sure what is so "stupid" about this.
We knew he hadn't released his birth certificate and it was very confusing why he wasn't doing it. Liberals mocked us for not accepting the 2008 certificate of Live Birth that Gibbs speaks of. They said we were crazy for not accepting this as evidence.
But we contended that a long-form birth certificate, which is important because people not born in Hawaii can still obtain a certificate of live birth, was necessary for proving he was born there. Yet liberals said there was nothing else to be shown.
Well obviously conservatives were right because Obama released something that wasn't released before - his long-form birth certificate that conservatives were demanding that he release. So the admnistration lied in saying that they had resolved the issue by releasing his certificate of live birth. Because, in the end, there was something else to be released.
Nothing about Frank Marshall Davis or being born in Kenya - just a very simple elucidation of the facts. In fact, it's really beyond simple logically.
"An unlikely fondness"
A pontificating liberal likes me?!?!
"We knew he hadn't released his birth certificate and it was very confusing why he wasn't doing it."
It's not really that confusing.
Some people clamored for evidence that Obama was born in Hawaii, because they wanted to invalidate the results of the election that they lost.
Massive amounts of evidence were produced that Obama was born in Hawaii. But the "birthers" decided that all the evidence produced wasn't enough, accused Obama of forging all the evidence they'd already produced, and demanded MORE evidence.
At this point, pretty much anyone would say You know what, get the fuck out of here -- and that's what the administration did. So, of course, "birthers" -- who behave no differently from 9/11 truthers -- decided that this meant there was no birth certificate.
They were wrong. The certificate wasn't produced because the birthers were behaving like stupid assholes, and most things that stupid assholes whine for, they don't get. Now that the birthers are proven wrong, and all their conspiracy theories are dead, they're whining, "Why didn't you show us this evidence AS SOON AS WE DEMANDED IT?"
And the answer is -- because you were acting like stupid assholes, assholes.
"Now that the birthers are proven wrong..."
For one, the term "birthers" has been used too broadly. If there TRULY was NO DOUBT, if it was SO stupid, why then did Obama release it yesterday?
Anyway, it's not that the birthers have been proven wrong, it's just that they have been given the proof for which they've been asking for 2 years.
Imagine you see your girlfriend coming out of a strange dude's house. You confront her, and she won't tell you why she was there and what she was doing. Would you be a little skeptical of her actions? Would you not suspect some things and come up with some possibilities? Then, one day you find out that dude was her cousin and she and he were throwing you a stripper party sans booby tassles. When she came forward with the truth, did she prove you wrong of your suspicions? Or, did she prove HERSELF by coming forward with the truth?
When people are given a reason to doubt something about anything, they will. The birthers didn't have proof that Obama was born in Kenya or wherever (not that he couldn't have been born in Kenya and still be an American citizen anyway) , they wanted to know what it was Obama was seemingly hiding.
Why the hell did it take Obama two years to produce this birth certificate? When: John McCain, John Kerry, George W. Bush, Al Gore, Bill Clinton, Michael Dukakis, Bob Dole, George Herbert Walker Bush, Ronald Reagan, and Walter Mondale all produced theirs during their first Presidential Campaigns? [Long form, not the redacted kind.]
Answer: because Obama and his people have a Nixonian habit of concealing EVERYTHING. Since they are so radical, filled with hate, and outside the mainstream, they have an ingrained habit of concealing EVERYTHING. Even stuff they should not. [Obama has a new enemies list btw just like Nixon.]
Obama is the new, new, new Nixon. From "Leading from Behind" to his ill-concealed hatred of parts of America, he's Nixon Part Two.
Where Nixon hated the Ivy League East Coast WASP Aristocracy, and ascendant Ivy League Jews (Katherine Graham and liberal connected Jews), Obama hates Middle Class Whites, and lower Class Whites, and symbols of Patriotic America. Hence the no flag lapel pins, cradling his crotch during the National Anthem, his "America is just another country" speeches, his bowing to foreign kings and dicators, and designating the UN and Arab League as deciders for US military engagement. From Louis Farrakhan (a frequent White House guest) to Rev. Wright and Rashid Khalidi, Obama is far outside the mainstream and driven by hatred for it, just like Nixon was driven by hate.
Hence conceal, conceal, conceal everything. No one trusts Obama because he has demonstrated zero personal loyalty and extreme evasiveness ala Nixon. He IS the new Nixon.
Only 38% of Americans before release of the Birth Certificate viewed Obama as certainly born in America. Because they don't trust him, and won't take the Media's word for it.
The Media sold Obama as the return of JFK, Clinton, and FDR combined. And what we got was an Affirmative Action incompetent, who dithered, seethed with ill-concealed rage against ordinary White people (Obama wrote in Dreams From My Father of also wanting to kill some random White guy to "cleanse" the White blood from his veins like Franz Fanon and Malcolm X had wished, and Fanon claimed). The Media said Obama was a God Who Walks Among Us, and he's not even as competent as Jimmy Carter.
So no one trusts Obama, who throws associates overboard, flip-flops all the time, has no coherent policies, has broken most of his campaign promises, and spends all his time playing Golf or making his NCAA Basketball Brackets on ESPN.
No one trusted "Slick Willy" either but HE delivered a robust economy (or rather, did not screw it up) and so got handily re-elected, and avoided conviction after openly lying to the American People.
The American people are simple. You can be a lying SOB all you want, just deliver. Clinton is a perfect example. HE never lost sight of the need to deliver a robust economy (or not screw it up). No one trusted him (because he was openly crooked) but he delivered on the most important thing which was the economy. So he's still popular today.
If you are crooked and incompetent like Al Gore, you can (barely) lose to a non-entity like Bush in 2000. If you are non-crooked, and honest, you have a fairly large margin, but even personally painfully honest Jimmy Carter got tossed when the incompetence got too large, for largely untried Ronald Reagan. Reagan was not brilliant, but delivered MASSIVE job growth in 1983-4 and so won re-election handily.
Obama is crooked, evasive, and Nixonian-shifty. None of that matters if he delivers, if he does not, then he's toast.
"No, you lunatic, it was the official form that certifies that a birth certificate exists on file."
Rabid progressives (or is that redundant?) continue to mischaracterize, i.e., lie about, the COLB certification of live birth. They would have us believe something that is not true. A COLB does not represent some other official document (i.e., the one finally released by The Vile Obama), regardless of whether such a document actually exists. Instead, the COLB is essentially a sham in that it can be issued at the whim of any relative's request, and therefore can easily contain misleading and/or incomplete information. In Hawaii, it is often issued to those born in another country in order to start a documentation trail for later use in obtaining US goodies like a drivers' license, Social Security Number, welfare, etc.
I don't expect progressives to apologize for their lies on this matter, because I know they are irrational zealots filled to overflowing with mindless tropes, fantasy narratives, and semantic games, and are therefore utterly incapable of either logical thought processes or morality-based civility. BTW, just judging by the liberal use of expletive-laced epithets, I'd guess that 'Dave' has been assigned to engage us all at OneSTDV by either MoveOn or HuffPo (the third alternative being Organizing for America who are usually more smugly sanctimonious without the gratuitous profanity).
@One
"Most mainstream birthers, like Trump, didn't put forth these forgery accusations. Quite simply, they just wanted the LONG-FORM birth certificate to be released."
Why would you want that, unless you believed that the short form was a fake?
"So the admnistration lied in saying that they had resolved the issue by releasing his certificate of live birth."
What was the lie? They said "Here is proof that Obama was born in Hawaii." Then they gave you proof. They didn't give you every conceivable unit of evidence -- you were never entitled to that. They gave you enough evidence for a reasonable person to conclude that Obama was born in Hawaii.
That's when you decided you'd rather be unreasonable.
@Honky Dory
" If there TRULY was NO DOUBT, if it was SO stupid, why then did Obama release it yesterday? "
Now it's getting sad. Let me get this straight: it's not only that Obama "looks suspicious" if he doesn't provide the long form birth certificate -- it now also looks suspicious if he DOES provide it?!
"When she came forward with the truth, did she prove you wrong of your suspicions?"
Yes.
Why not attack the crazy birthers? I don't see why Obama has to divulge his private details to anyone who asks. After all, to become President requires no I.D. or background check? Doesn't getting a driver's licence require I.D.? Getting married, etc.? Apparently for birthers anyone can just chum up to become President no questions asked.
There are a number of irregularities in the released BC, including mismatched fonts and vertical misalignment.
There has been some discussion about PDF layers. Some people said that layers are not a problem because they are automatically generated by the process of scanning. But this guy demonstrates (convincingly, in my non-professional opinion) that this document could not have been scanned.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eOfYwYyS_c
@Dave
"Now it's getting sad. Let me get this straight: it's not only that Obama "looks suspicious" if he doesn't provide the long form birth certificate -- it now also looks suspicious if he DOES provide it?!"
I can't help but think you are purposefully being obtuse. The physical act of providing this birth certificate is NOT suspicious. If this is what you believe me or anyone else is arguing, there probably isn't much more to talk about.
The suspicion lies in the time it took to provide it. There are certainly many anti-Obamaites that will never believe, no matter how much proof, but we're not talking about them here.
There are no legit questions to ask about Obama, or any liberal for that matter. Rev Wright, Bill Ayers, etc, et al. It must be nice to be able to call ANYONE crazy or racist who ask questions about shady pasts, nefarious aquaintances, and suspicious behaviors. This is a benefit held only by the Left due to the media's help.
@ Dave (again)
"When she came forward with the truth, did she prove you wrong of your suspicions?"
Yes.
____________
So, would you say that you were wrong to ask questions or be suspicious? Or are you the type that just believes anything anyone says all the time at face value?
LOL, nothing brings out the fruitypants liberals like any questioning of the Messiah. Dave has the pink brigage mobilized and the liberal weenie are talkin' tough!! And they've got hands on hips, fingers snapping and they're typing in ALL CAPS to show that they ain't playin' this time.
Shame on you whitey conservatives for blaspheming the name of the messiah, when he's just trying to save us from ourselves by rapidly expanding the size of government at every turn. The Messiah doesn't need to answer questions about his anything, he's got more important things to do like fly out to Oprah tapings or have beer summits to meddle in local police affairs.
The more indignant the liberal pansies get the more they hope that it will take America's mind off the fact that Obama is an inneffective, overmatched President who is little more than a soul-ed up version of John Kerry in blackface.
After reading Dave's little sissy diatribes I'm thinking that he probably let out a little classic Howard Dean "manly man" scream at the end to show that he really means business !!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5FzCeV0ZFc
"The physical act of providing this birth certificate is NOT suspicious."
You said yourself that it was. Remember? "If there TRULY was NO DOUBT, if it was SO stupid, why then did Obama release it yesterday?"
"The suspicion lies in the time it took to provide it."
Suspicion of WHAT? There's a pretty obvious reason why he took his time -- he had no respect for the people who were demanding his birth certificate -- with good reason.
But what more sinister explanation did you have in mind?
"There are no legit questions to ask about Obama, or any liberal for that matter."
Now THAT'S a "straw man" argument. You can ask whatever question you want, HD, but if it's incredibly stupid, you'll get laughed at.
"So, would you say that you were wrong to ask questions or be suspicious?"
No, but your suspicions should have something to do with reality.
@camlost
"After reading Dave's little sissy diatribes"
Call me a sissy when you're done posting under your chickenshit code name.
"You said yourself that it was. Remember? "If there TRULY was NO DOUBT, if it was SO stupid, why then did Obama release it yesterday?"
This makes no sense. This is why I say you are being obtuse, probably on purpose. Maybe you are unclear of the word "suspicious"? I'm at a loss of words.
"But what more sinister explanation did you have in mind?"
I've never had any doubts that Obama was ineligible for the presidency. I have no problems with questioning. If there was doubt, Obama, like EVERY OTHER president, could have just shown this early on and let it go. I think he held it back on purpose to make the otherside look like kooks, which played in with the media's portrayal.
_____
"There are no legit questions to ask about Obama, or any liberal for that matter."
Now THAT'S a "straw man" argument. You can ask whatever question you want, HD, but if it's incredibly stupid, you'll get laughed at.
It's true. Any questioning of policy , past relationships, anything, is racist. I'm reminded of how genocide works, the perpetrators just laugh it off and pretend nothing is going on.
____
"So, would you say that you were wrong to ask questions or be suspicious?"
No, but your suspicions should have something to do with reality.
The reality is he withheld his birth certificate. The reality is he misdirected any questions about it, and like you said, laughed it off. The reality is he could have stifled this long ago. BUt he didn't. And asking about it is somehow crazy. There ARE some crazies out there, like I said before. But I doubt you know fully what the birthers are. You probably think it's ONLY about the redneck yelling "he's a Muslim born in Kenya!"
I'm done with you now. I've wasted too much time on this, as well as energy.
"This makes no sense."
It makes perfect sense. Your choice of words implies that his providing the birth certificate was somehow proof that the birthers were reasonable in asking for it. That it validated their suspicions.
Perhaps you simply miscommunicated your thoughts.
"I think he held it back on purpose to make the otherside look like kooks..."
They played right into his hands, in that case.
"It's true. Any questioning of policy , past relationships, anything, is racist."
Fantasy. I never accused you of being racist.
Here's a blog I read and support, where Obama is criticized daily.
http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/index.html
"The reality is he withheld his birth certificate."
Your entire argument falls apart once you realize that -- in response to requests for proof that he was born here -- he had already provided enough evidence to show that he was.
REPEAT: THERE HAS BEEN A LOT OF EVIDENCE, FOR YEARS, THAT OBAMA WAS A CITIZEN. ASKING FOR HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE WAS, THEREFORE, A WASTE OF EVERYONE'S TIME.
"The reality is he could have stifled this long ago. But he didn't."
He certainly tried. He provided a lot of evidence. It didn't work in convincing people that he was telling the truth.
Making it quite reasonable that he ignored requests for more evidence. You and One keep ignoring this point.
"I'm done with you now."
Bye-bye, quitter!
Wittle Davey got upset.
His pink briefs are now awwwwwww wet.
"Call me a sissy when you're done posting under your chickenshit code name."
Until you use your first and last names and can verify them, stfu. "Dave" is just as much a 'code name.'
One hard fact remains. B Obama found the full diclosure of his birth records so unpleasant a prospect that he had his people fight against having to do so for over 2 years.
Every American I know would not understand that. It would feel good to show off anything showing we were Natural Born Citizens. That it should feel bad suggests that B. Obama has a massive chip on his shoulder and/or has deeply mixed feeling about this country.
Not the sort I want as a Commander in Chief. How about you?
Now that the birthers are proven wrong....
They weren't proven wrong; they were proven right. Obama had not released his birth certificate.
-- BRT
LOL, nothing brings out the fruitypants liberals like any questioning of the Messiah. Dave has the pink brigage mobilized and the liberal weenie are talkin' tough!! And they've got hands on hips, fingers snapping and they're typing in ALL CAPS to show that they ain't playin' this time.
Good stuff!
--- Ben Tillman
REPEAT: THERE HAS BEEN A LOT OF EVIDENCE, FOR YEARS, THAT OBAMA WAS A CITIZEN. ASKING FOR HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE WAS, THEREFORE, A WASTE OF EVERYONE'S TIME.
What an unbelievable moron this clown is! Being a citizen doesn't mean you were born here.
Over the years I've been getting so upset about Obama's lies and evasions. I invested a lot emotionally into him finally being found out for who he is, but every time my hope was raised it was frustrated. He has some very powerful people (or forces of evil, if you believe in the existence of such a thing) behind him.
I now officially give up. I don't care about Obama. I am going to think about the sun, beautiful flowers, and my self-fulfillment. If God exists, let him bring Obama to justice and reveal the truth. It's out of my hands. If he doesn't exist, I am just going to enjoy life and think only happy thoughts.
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